how long should my consumable last??

For general topics and questions that do not fit into any of the other categories or forums.
Post Reply
leadsled71
1 Star Member
1 Star Member
Posts: 24
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2016 6:59 pm

how long should my consumable last??

Post by leadsled71 »

using hypertherm power max 65 machine on my tracker cnc table, I seem to go through electrodes and nozzle very frequently. say if I'm cutting 7" circles out of 3/8 on 65amp, each 7" Circle has 5-10 half inch holes and a 3" hole in the very center, so I'm making anywhere from 8 to 12 pierces per part maybe, I'll put on a new electrode and Nozzle, by the times I've cut 7 pieces it's cutting ugly, put on new electrode and nozzle then cuts fine. so I'm cutting maybe 7 or 8 minutes straight on new parts.

I have a 60 gallon compressor that I drain daily, hooked to a refrigerated dryer, then 25ft of copper coil then to my sharpe dryaire desiccant system. then 15ft to my plasma cart which.has a motor guard. 01 micron toilet paper style filter. when it starts cutting poorly I check my.desiccant system and they're is no visible moisture in the water trap or the oil coalescer.

I tried the aftermarket consumables because I go through so many, they lasted about as long as the hypertherm ones. anyone have a suggestion?
jimcolt
5 Star Elite Contributing Member
5 Star Elite Contributing Member
Posts: 3087
Joined: Mon Jul 20, 2009 11:18 pm
Location: North Carolina

Re: how long should my consumable last??

Post by jimcolt »

You should be able to cut about 300 or so of those circles.....then you may have to change the nozzle (not the electrode). How about posting good pictures (so I can see the nozzle orifice clearly) of a nozzle you have taken out under the above conditions. Also...list the part numbers of what you are using....of the shield, nozzle, electrode, swirl ring. A picture of a take out electrode as well.

Even if you are mixing in one aftermarket part....you stand the chance of ruining all of the consumables. There are huge differences in manufacturing that affect stack up tolerances....remember there are 25,000 degree temperatures inside the torch body.

Make sure your mode switch is in cut mode (not gouge or continuous pilot). Make sure air is clean and dry (no oil, no moisture), make sure the air flow is in auto mode. Make sure you are following the pierce height and pierce delay specs as listed in the cut charts in your operators manual.

Jim Colt Hypertherm
leadsled71
1 Star Member
1 Star Member
Posts: 24
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2016 6:59 pm

Re: how long should my consumable last??

Post by leadsled71 »

thanks Jim I will get pictures of the used ones I've taken out. they still look almost new to me. I'm using hypertherm 220819 electrodes and 220842 nozzles. I'm not mixing them with aftermarket, I just tried a pack of the aftermarket ones to see if there was any difference.
leadsled71
1 Star Member
1 Star Member
Posts: 24
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2016 6:59 pm

Re: how long should my consumable last??

Post by leadsled71 »

here is a picture after about 6 or 7 minutes of cutting with a new electrode and nozzle.

Image

Image

Image

there was no visible moisture in any of the traps in the 3 stage desiccant system. the water seperator and coalesor are bone dry.
davek0974
4 Star Member
4 Star Member
Posts: 764
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2014 8:30 am
Location: Hertfordshire, England
Contact:

Re: how long should my consumable last??

Post by davek0974 »

That nozzle looks ok to me, when my PM45 ones go they usually blow a chunk out of one side so i get bad taper on one edge.

When you say the cut is ugly, what does it look like??
Doc Hollywood
2.5 Star Member
2.5 Star Member
Posts: 148
Joined: Fri Jun 28, 2013 4:36 pm

Re: how long should my consumable last??

Post by Doc Hollywood »

is it possible something else is changing when this happens? those consumables look OK to me. Is height control on track? Cutting in the correct direction i assume?
:)
leadsled71
1 Star Member
1 Star Member
Posts: 24
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2016 6:59 pm

Re: how long should my consumable last??

Post by leadsled71 »

my cuts go from very good quality to edges that have a taper one way or another, holes out of round, the cut edge isn't even straight it's wavy. so I have to pry the cut part up to break it loose from the sheet to even remove it off the table. gets bad enough I have to slow my cut spped way down to even cut through all the way.

I basically throw my consumables away when they still look like pics above. I only use my table maybe an hour a week because it eats so many consumables, some days I loose more than I make with it.

no one can seem to pin point my issue. tracker blamed my air quality, but I literally can't install any more filters or know how to improve it any further.
leadsled71
1 Star Member
1 Star Member
Posts: 24
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2016 6:59 pm

Re: how long should my consumable last??

Post by leadsled71 »

whenever I pause it while cutting, whether good or bad the cut height is always the same. I follow the guidelines in my hypertherm manual, and have great cuts when it's cutting properly. I was having issues with my power source acting funny but traced it down to my plug in on my outlet needed replaced. it operates fine now, just eats up hundreds of dollars in electrodes and nozzles a month, only using it a few hours a month
davek0974
4 Star Member
4 Star Member
Posts: 764
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2014 8:30 am
Location: Hertfordshire, England
Contact:

Re: how long should my consumable last??

Post by davek0974 »

I don't think its air quality, my system is far less 'complete' thank yours and its generally damp here in the UK and I never see any water in the traps.

My system suffer the exact same fault - great then angled cuts, new parts, great then angled cuts......

I have consumable trackers on my screen and sometimes I get a total of 20-30mins cut time and others only 10mins before failure. Yes I will admit I have tried pattern parts but makes no difference so gone back to genuine. My stuff is mostly 3mm steel but arty cuts so a fair amount of piercing, I have checked the pierce height etc and its always good.

Maybe we only get massive cut times in lab conditions??
User avatar
SeanP
4 Star Member
4 Star Member
Posts: 950
Joined: Thu Aug 01, 2013 11:50 am
Location: Co Kerry, Ireland

Re: how long should my consumable last??

Post by SeanP »

Do you find genuine last any better than the plasmatech ones Dave?
davek0974 wrote: Yes I will admit I have tried pattern parts but makes no difference so gone back to genuine.
Powermax XP45
Home built table, Candcnc DTHC 2, Dragoncut 620-4
R-Tech 210 Tig, Jasic 250 mig
Sheetcam, Scanything, Coreldraw
Table build gallery
davek0974
4 Star Member
4 Star Member
Posts: 764
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2014 8:30 am
Location: Hertfordshire, England
Contact:

Re: how long should my consumable last??

Post by davek0974 »

SeanP wrote:Do you find genuine last any better than the plasmatech ones Dave?
davek0974 wrote: Yes I will admit I have tried pattern parts but makes no difference so gone back to genuine.
Slightly yes, but i have not worked out the cost saving/loss yet, too busy burning stuff ;)

They certainly both do not last hours though, I keep an eye on it but don't panic unduly, my prices include enough to cover but obviously its a cost loss if they blow quickly.
User avatar
tnbndr
4.5 Star Elite Contributing Member
4.5 Star Elite Contributing Member
Posts: 1669
Joined: Mon Jan 09, 2012 4:30 pm
Location: New Berlin, WI
Contact:

Re: how long should my consumable last??

Post by tnbndr »

Maybe we only get massive cut times in lab conditions??
I don't cut in a lab and my consumables last what I consider quite a long time. Sometimes longer than I think they should.
I would like to set up a timer/tracker for consumables in Mach 3 or ??? but have no clue how to do that.
Cutting multiple pierce artwork files I can usually cut about 4-5 4'x8' sheets of 14 gauge to 10 gauge steel before changing.
Dennis
LDR 4x8, Scribe, DTHCIV
Hypertherm PM45, Macair Dryer
DeVilbiss Air America 6.5HP, 80Gal., 175psi, Two Stage
16.9scfm@100psi, 16.0scfm@175psi
Miller 215 MultiMatic
RW 390E Slip Roll (Powered)
AutoCAD, SheetCAM, Mach 3
http://ikescreations.com
davek0974
4 Star Member
4 Star Member
Posts: 764
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2014 8:30 am
Location: Hertfordshire, England
Contact:

Re: how long should my consumable last??

Post by davek0974 »

The timer/counter was easy, its just a little bit of code added to the M03/M05 macros and two DRO's added to screen, cut time and pierce count, I also added reset buttons.
User avatar
acourtjester
6 Star Elite Contributing Member
6 Star Elite Contributing Member
Posts: 7770
Joined: Sat Jun 02, 2012 6:04 pm
Location: Pensacola, Fla

Re: how long should my consumable last??

Post by acourtjester »

The Job report in SheetCam give you that info before you actually do the cutting.
DIY 4X4 Plasma/Router Table
Hypertherm PM65 Machine Torch
Drag Knife and Scribe
Miller Mig welder
13" metal lathe
Small Mill
Everlast PowerTig 255 EXT
muzza
4 Star Member
4 Star Member
Posts: 1472
Joined: Wed Feb 04, 2009 5:35 pm

Re: how long should my consumable last??

Post by muzza »

Sounds like a pretty low life to me Dave, sounds like somethings not right.

I can't give you an exact time per part but I have at least one cutter cutting pretty much 6 to 8 hours per day 5 days per week, often much more and I have a standing order with my consumable supplier for 25 nozzles and 10 electrodes per month and when I accumulate too many I get them to not supply that month. I know I did check a long time ago when we were doing a run on some signs I make which average 40 pierces and about 120 cut inches each and we were getting around 80 signs from memory on a nozzle but this was only on 16 gauge.
Murray
leadsled71
1 Star Member
1 Star Member
Posts: 24
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2016 6:59 pm

Re: how long should my consumable last??

Post by leadsled71 »

if I'm cutting anything 11 ga or thinner they seem to cut much longer. I mostly cut 1/4 and 3/8 plate.
davek0974
4 Star Member
4 Star Member
Posts: 764
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2014 8:30 am
Location: Hertfordshire, England
Contact:

Re: how long should my consumable last??

Post by davek0974 »

Thats pretty annoying then, I have no idea what it is.

I have finely checked all the setup, the THC does very accurate IHS, it drops to cut height as fast as possible, tracks well on the cut, the air system has a refrigerated dryer and two traps plus the internal one. Air pressure is very stable.
User avatar
acourtjester
6 Star Elite Contributing Member
6 Star Elite Contributing Member
Posts: 7770
Joined: Sat Jun 02, 2012 6:04 pm
Location: Pensacola, Fla

Re: how long should my consumable last??

Post by acourtjester »

it drops to cut height as fast as possible :o
maybe that is to fast, could it be causing ejected metal to damage the tips???
I use a drop speed of F60 between pierce and cut.
DIY 4X4 Plasma/Router Table
Hypertherm PM65 Machine Torch
Drag Knife and Scribe
Miller Mig welder
13" metal lathe
Small Mill
Everlast PowerTig 255 EXT
davek0974
4 Star Member
4 Star Member
Posts: 764
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2014 8:30 am
Location: Hertfordshire, England
Contact:

Re: how long should my consumable last??

Post by davek0974 »

Well it only drops after the pierce delay which on my system is a minimum of 0.3s as that is the response time of the control loop.

It was set fast to reduce the hole on open path pierces etc, i think its set at 1300mm/m
User avatar
_Ogre
3.5 Star Member
3.5 Star Member
Posts: 529
Joined: Sun Sep 15, 2013 4:26 pm
Location: Motown

Re: how long should my consumable last??

Post by _Ogre »

78 pieces, 390 pierces with 1/2'' mild steel on each sheet
i changed nozzles after 2 sheets, 780 pierces
only because i was nervous about the nozzle
not because it was cutting bad

Image
bulltear 4x8 cnc plasma table, candcnc bladerunner w/dthc, hypertherm powermax 65, sheetcam, mach3
laser cross hair for hypertherm torch http://www.plasmaspider.com/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=12508
an ogre smiley :mrgreen: how cool!
davek0974
4 Star Member
4 Star Member
Posts: 764
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2014 8:30 am
Location: Hertfordshire, England
Contact:

Re: how long should my consumable last??

Post by davek0974 »

I wouldn't get anywhere near that, don't forget my unit is a PM45 though.
leadsled71
1 Star Member
1 Star Member
Posts: 24
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2016 6:59 pm

Re: how long should my consumable last??

Post by leadsled71 »

_Ogre wrote:78 pieces, 390 pierces with 1/2'' mild steel on each sheet
i changed nozzles after 2 sheets, 780 pierces
only because i was nervous about the nozzle
not because it was cutting bad

Image

something like that would have taken me probably at least 5 or 6 new electrodes and nozzles to do same thing.
User avatar
SeanP
4 Star Member
4 Star Member
Posts: 950
Joined: Thu Aug 01, 2013 11:50 am
Location: Co Kerry, Ireland

Re: how long should my consumable last??

Post by SeanP »

If that's a 4' x 8' sheet, I'd get nearly 2 sheets of 12mm with that sort of cutting with the pmax 45, that's with a waterlogged air supply and no dryer, been remedying that this week with redesigned pipework:

Added T piece and riser, pipe continues to drop down leg with drain valve.
IMG_7157.JPG

You currently do not have access to download this file.
To gain download access for DXF, SVG & other files Click Here

Powermax XP45
Home built table, Candcnc DTHC 2, Dragoncut 620-4
R-Tech 210 Tig, Jasic 250 mig
Sheetcam, Scanything, Coreldraw
Table build gallery
davek0974
4 Star Member
4 Star Member
Posts: 764
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2014 8:30 am
Location: Hertfordshire, England
Contact:

Re: how long should my consumable last??

Post by davek0974 »

I'm with ledsled71 - I would likely need a new nozzle at least for each sheet, probably more.

No idea why the variation in life, but I have always suffered it I think. Starts off great, then one side always goes bevelled, then if i choose to carry on it gets worse and worse.
User avatar
see&see
2.5 Star Elite Contributing Member
2.5 Star Elite Contributing Member
Posts: 218
Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2014 12:04 pm
Location: Minden, Nevada
Contact:

Re: how long should my consumable last??

Post by see&see »

I made some window security bars up while making similar bracket pieces out of 1/2" MS and kept about 1/2" remaining space between the pieces using almost no lead in to keep it clean. Zero waste on that job.. :lol: 65 amp process with .21 pierce height and 1 second pierce delay and wait for pierce to complete before moving...

With a higher pierce height (over book) I am getting close to what Orge is on consumable life on 1/2" MS. The bolt holes will really run up the pierce counts faster than you think.. Book specs on pierce height ate the nozzle's up much quicker......
You marry into the PlasmaCam family and must accept the fact your software and hardware are proprietary. It's a for better or for worse engagement with overwhelming security. PlasmaCam controls the computer, table, hardware to their advantage IMO. :x
Post Reply

Return to “CNC Plasma Cutters General Forum”