New member and a problem-Camcutcnc

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Mtw fdu
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New member and a problem-Camcutcnc

Post by Mtw fdu »

Hey all.

First time on this site and need some help please.

Got a plasma cutter from Camcutcnc and having trouble getting it to start the plasma via the controller. I can start it by shorting it out when it is not connected but as soon as I connect to controller it just won't start.

My cnc guy gave me some settings but nothing seems to work. Anybody here with any info would be greatly appreciated.

Just a heads up...here is my cutter doing a marker pen test.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYKlgC9KKYc

Thanks guys.

Mtw fdu.
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Re: New member and a problem

Post by Mtw fdu »

Just been contacted by my cnc guy and he seems to think everything has been set. He said that the relay is the only thing which may be the problem.

A question please guys...

My plasma has a 2 wire relay going from the plasma to the inside of the controller. I have had the cover off to see inside and the 2 wires go to a ON connection and a plus(+) or minus(-) connection. Does a 2 wire relay need to go to 2 ON's? As there is 2 ON's used for a 3 wire setup. Follow the link to get a pic of the board I have got.

http://i01.i.aliimg.com/img/pb/438/277/ ... 38_868.jpg

You may have to zoom in to see it properly.

Thanks guys.

Mtw fdu.
jimcolt
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Re: New member and a problem

Post by jimcolt »

It helps if you supply more info. There are a few hundred different plasma cutters available....they do not all interface the same. There are also many different cnc machine outputs as well as different CAM software that sends the signal to start the plasma. You also could probably get the best help from your machine supplier (CamCut)

Jim
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Re: New member and a problem

Post by Mtw fdu »

You also could probably get the best help from your machine supplier (CamCut)

Sorry Jim but that boat has already sailed...I have had trouble with him from the day I ordered my machine(13 March 2014) and it is still not running. The build time was 3 weeks...I ended up getting the machine at the end of September.

But here is some more info.

Machine from Camcutcnc
Machine has USB with a THC (proma model)
I use Bobcad software (which have been really good to me with info etc. Haven't had a single problem with them)
He supplied auto cad with his machine which has stepper motors etc.
The plans he sent were hard to understand.
His website is very basic. Doesn't give a lot of info out on his machines.
Need to get a post processor made by Bobcad to recognise Camcut machine.

I went to the USA for holidays back in early August and went to see the guy at Camcut. He is only a 1 man band and he was very "stand-offish" towards me. He also had someone else there when I turned up(he didn't think someone would travel 26000 kilometres to see him). Here is a link to his website.

http://www.camcutcnc.com/

Hopefully that will give you a bit more info.

Thank you for your reply.

Mtw fdu.
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Re: New member and a problem

Post by WyoGreen »

We still need to know what brand of plasma cutter you are using, i.e. Hypertherm?
It looks like your controller is operated by Mach3 controller software. Do you have a manual Torch on button on your screen? You should be able to fire the torch that way, or a least hear the relay click. Basically, Mach3 needs to send a torch on to the control board via what appears to be the parallel port on your computer. This should operate the relay on your control board to close the contacts and tell the plasma cutter to initiate the torch to fire.Since you can fire the torch manually, then the relay must not be operating. Perhaps the ports and pin assignments in Mach3 are not set up right.
We really need much more information to be able to help you.

Good luck, Steve
Precision Plasma gantry
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Mtw fdu
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Re: New member and a problem

Post by Mtw fdu »

Plasma cutter is a Hypertherm Powermax 45. I am using Mach 3 for the software as well. I also have a mechanical torch.

I have just been told by my cnc guy that the relay on output 1 has to be connected to the MOV...wherever that is.

He said I have to connect the relay wires and the MOV together and connect them both to Output 2.

Something else I will mention...the system was designed to use on Windows 89 but I am using Windows 7. That may help with any suggestions.

I would prefer not to change anything with the wiring if possible.

Let me know if you need any other info.

Thank you for your reply.

Mtw fdu.
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Re: New member and a problem

Post by jimcolt »

Well....first thing I would do is to jumper the input start on the Powermax45 (you said you were using a machine torch, not a hand torch)....this is done on pins 3 and 4 of the CPC interface connector on the rear panel of the PMX45. If power and air are on and correct...and consumables are in the torch it should fire.

If it fires...next step is to trace whatever wiring or cable that is connected to the CPC port....to where it is connected on your breakout board. Jumper the same signal there at its connections....the torch should fire.

The next step, assuming the torch fires in both instances above is with determining why the output relay of your breakout board is not activating the start signal the same way that jumpering is doing. You have a conglomeration of different softwares and hardware that may or may not be compatible. If the system is designed to use on Windows 98....that could be your issue *using Windows 7)

Without some sort of help from the suppliers of your softwareand hardware....you will likely be out of luck. Can you find anyone that has the exact same setup that you have? Maybe CamCut can direct you to another user that is successfully operating their machine?

Jim Colt Hypertherm
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Re: New member and a problem

Post by tcaudle »

Mtw fdu wrote:Plasma cutter is a Hypertherm Powermax 45. I am using Mach 3 for the software as well. I also have a mechanical torch.

I have just been told by my cnc guy that the relay on output 1 has to be connected to the MOV...wherever that is.

He said I have to connect the relay wires and the MOV together and connect them both to Output 2.

Something else I will mention...the system was designed to use on Windows 89 but I am using Windows 7. That may help with any suggestions.

I would prefer not to change anything with the wiring if possible.

Let me know if you need any other info.

Thank you for your reply.

Mtw fdu.
Well in most languages MOV in electronics stands for Metal Oxide Varister and is used to clamp voltages to prevent surges. In this context i am not sure what they are talking about. That controller is a Chinese 3 axis TBA6560 based BoB and motor driver; 39.00 to 59.00 on e-bay. If you want some idea of the product search CNC zone for TBA6560 and check the threads. If I were you I would find the identical controller and buy a couple of spares.

Besides a basic lack of instructions other than diagrams, the performance of that system won't be very good. Small Steppers running on 24VDC with direct drive off one side just lack the torque to provide much acceleration (which is probably a good thing because the gantry would rack badly if the G forces are too high).

I know this is probably just a hobby and a garage toy, but its frustrating when you can't make it do the basics (like fire the torch) and support seems limited at best. Nothing's a good deal if you can't make it work.
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Re: New member and a problem

Post by Mtw fdu »

Thanks guys for your replies.

Just to give you more info I have done a test cut when I fire the plasma by shorting the 2 connections together. When I do this the THC works exactly the way it is supposed to. Also the speeds and feeds are set to my plate thickness and the cut Kerf and cut quality are exceptional. The cut size is about 3mm (1/8) and there is no dros to clean up. This happens according to plan when the machine has been shorted to start.

My problem is getting it to start!! I have to join the 2 wires from the relay to the MOV and reconnect them both to output 2. Where is Output 2 on the board?

@tcaudle Can you tell me where the MOV is exactly on the board so I can get a better understanding?

Thanks again guys for your input.

Below are 2 pics of my board. The first is the board with everything exposed. The second, where my thumb is where the 2 wires go from the plasma cutter(relay). These pics may shed some light. Also on the right side of the first pic (next to the blue panel/box) and in between the main board is a little board which has not been screwed down or fastened properly to the mounts. There are small holes drilled but not deep enough to insert a screw. Could this be a problem...not being earthed?


Mtw fdu.

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Mtw fdu
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Re: New member and a problem

Post by Mtw fdu »

Another question guys.

For the g-code, does the "torch on" need to be set as M03 or M3? Or doesn't it really matter?

I have noticed on other g-codes it is set as M03. Is M3 for mill?

Mtw fdu.
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Re: New member and a problem

Post by vmax549 »

M3 or M03 same thing as to setup of the relay. Just get the port and pins correct.

(;-0)TP
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Re: New member and a problem-Camcutcnc

Post by Mtw fdu »

I have put all the port and pin numbers as instructed by my cnc guy. Do I now try different numbers to try and get it going before I change the wiring setup? Still waiting for a reply from my cnc guy about how to set them up from Output 1 to Output 2.

Mtw fdu.
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Re: New member and a problem-Camcutcnc

Post by Mtw fdu »

Just an update guys.

I pulled the 2 wires for the switch to the relay and the MOV and found that the wires were only connecting 1 or 2 strands of wire instead of the whole lot. The terminal is very tiny and it was hard but I ended up getting them in and tighten down firmly.(not over tight but just firm).

Retried to cut but no success. Tried to adjust and recheck all port and pins and everything is set as they were previously.

I am now at my wits end and will leave it until I am in a good frame of mind and maybe in a few days time have another go.

Keep any suggestions coming please.


Thank you kindly.

Mtw fdu.
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Re: New member and a problem-Camcutcnc

Post by WyoGreen »

Did you go over to CNCZone and read some of the posts on this board? There is a ton of info over there on it.

i.e. http://www.cnczone.com/forums/stepper-m ... 4-cnc.html

Steve
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Re: New member and a problem-Camcutcnc

Post by tcaudle »

Mtw fdu wrote:Just an update guys.

I pulled the 2 wires for the switch to the relay and the MOV and found that the wires were only connecting 1 or 2 strands of wire instead of the whole lot. The terminal is very tiny and it was hard but I ended up getting them in and tighten down firmly.(not over tight but just firm).

Retried to cut but no success. Tried to adjust and recheck all port and pins and everything is set as they were previously.

I am now at my wits end and will leave it until I am in a good frame of mind and maybe in a few days time have another go.

Keep any suggestions coming please.


Thank you kindly.

Mtw fdu.
I think from the limited picto-doc you posted they have two outputs. They want you to use THEIR output 2 for external fire of the torch. Here is where is is confusing. The "outputs" in MACH are not the same. You can map any output SIGNAL in MACH to any set of physical pins ont he parallel port. In most circumstances by default the common G code that turns on the torch is "M3" (or M03) and that is usually assigned to Ouput1 (MACH signal). Here is the key: You need to know which physical port and pin the Chinese assigned the THEIR output 2. That will be port 1 and some pin number of 4 available" Pin 1, pin 14 , pin 16 and pin 17. Since other output signals are used (charge pump) not all of them are available. If you got a MACH setup profile from you "CNC guy" it should have the BOARD OUPUT2 mapped by port and pin to MACH ouput1.

If you play "pick the pin ans see what happens " you will drive yourself to the edge of insanity. There are 12 "outputs" in MACh for a single parallel port, but most of them are for the Step & Dir signals for each axis. You have 4 ; that is 8 signals to motion and 4 open for other "stuff"

It there is a chart somewhere on that Card then it would really help and you could just put the port and pin designators for the BOARD Output 2 into the pin mapping in MACH for output 1. There are other possibilities and you can also make output2 in MACH get activated by M03 but then the torch button on your screen won't match up

Good luck. You should have quite a challenge getting the magic "dance" that is required for plasma to work. .
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Re: New member and a problem-Camcutcnc

Post by Mtw fdu »

I have asked my cnc guy to send me each page of the config sections so I can go through and punch in the required settings. He keeps telling me that everything should be set up properly and refuses to send me the pages I want. Every time he tells me to do something he also tells me to check a pin and port in output and inputs and tells then what they need to be. This is where the problem is. He is so unco-operative with just sending the pages which would make my life and his much easier, but he decides to take the harder step. I cannot control this but if "anybody" on this site has a Camcutcnc setup I would be happy to chat with you.

Mtw fdu.
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Re: New member and a problem-Camcutcnc

Post by Mtw fdu »

Guys.

I did some trials with my Mach 3 screen and was wondering a few things.

What are the charge pumps for in the Output section of ports and pins? Do I need to do anything with them?

Also I tried the currents Hi/low and when it was on it "clicked" when the voltage etc was high and low. Do I need this to be turned on or not. Or is it not necessary to have on?

I also noticed on the board when I moved the x, y, or z the lights that were on went off when they went in a direction and came back on when they went the opposite way. Also the light next to these when I pressed them only just lit up when they were pressed. The red light on in the same group of lights is also on all the time. What does this mean?? Is it not enough power or something is not right?

Thanks guys.

Mtw fdu.
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Re: New member and a problem-Camcutcnc

Post by grindergary »

Without sounding like a jerk, it is very hard to help you because I do not know what equipment you have.

My advise to you is get the manual and read it. If it is written well, it should have everything you need like port and pin settings and all your screen descriptions.

I have been following this thread and can't believe that you don't have a manual or have not read it. If all they can give you is verbal set up information, I would send it back for a refund and then find a manufacturer that will at least help you.

I built my table and learned as I went. I have manuals for all my electronics (CandCNC) and any other parts I needed as well as all my software. I spent many hours reading the manuals and that was before I even started my build.

I have been up and running for a few years now and still learn new things all the time with my table.

I am sorry if I come across as a jerk, but like I say, if you don't have the information from the manufacturer, I would be screaming like hell till they either gave me the information or returned the table.

Just my thoughts...

Gary
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Re: New member and a problem-Camcutcnc

Post by Mtw fdu »

Gary

Thank you for your comments. However...let me tell you a short story.

I ordered my machine on the 13 March 2014. It was supposed to be a 3 week build. I received it late September (after I visited him in the US). During that time I tried to get a refund because he was not sending it. I even went through Paypal and could not do anything because I started my claim after the 45 day period. If I sent it back he would not accept it as the chances of getting my money back are useless (at best). His software came with a disc (which I only got when I went and saw him) as he had sent my table before I went overseas. It was also stuck in customs for 7 weeks and I had to pay more money just to get it. Without my time I have spent $12000 to this point. The disc contained a manual for the 89 setup version using autocad and a parallel port. My machine uses a USB with THC and the software was suppose to be for my machine. I have sent between 30 and 40 emails asking for help and info but he said it should set it up when the software has been installed. My setup was the first 1 he ever did (apparently).His last email he told me he had a 1 wire solution to my problem. I think that he forgot to do some wiring and now making excuses which I am very familiar with over the past 10 months. I have also tried to contact him by phone but it always goes to his voice mailbox. He has never returned my calls but has emailed me rather than calling me. Sometimes when I email him I do not get a response for a few weeks which I have also told him (on many occasions) his service is the worst I have had. I must stress that he is the only person who I have dealt with in the US with really bad service. Everyone else I have had no problems with whatsoever.


I am now still waiting for his "1 wire solution" to be sent to me with a picture to describe where to put it. That is where I am now so hopefully you have a better understanding of what is happening. All I have to do is get my torch working properly and as I have said in previous posts everything else works properly.

Again thank you for your input.

I have also posted my problem on cnczone but after over 160 views I have had no responses.


Mtw fdu.

My table details:

2 x 2 foot table.
Camcutcnc software, and Mach 3 and Bobcad V26
Hypertherm Powermax 45 plasma with mechanised torch.
3Stepper motors
UC 100 cnc motion controller V2. 133.
JP-3163B breakout board
tm america
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Re: New member and a problem-Camcutcnc

Post by tm america »

Andy at camcut is a pretty knowledgable guy..You can do a couple quick test to see if it is the cutter or machine or controller..first try shorting the trigger wires together .if it triggers it most likely is not the cutter but some cutters have a switch for machine or hand cutting make sure it is in the correct position.Second hook a multi meter to the torch trigger wires coming from the controller to see it they get continuity when it sees a m3 code..You can turn the torch on from the mach3 screen but on some computer boards it will only allow it to trigger one time manually then you will have to hit reset...If you don't see it getting contiunity go into your ports and pins and make sure under motor outputs the spindle is enabled.then got to output signal and make sure the correct port and pin are selected and the output 1 is enabled .then under spindle setup relay control make sure m3 is output 2 and m4 is output 1..Hit apply then ok.. test it again
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Re: New member and a problem-Camcutcnc

Post by Mtw fdu »

@tm America

Thank you for your reply.

I have had the torch going by shorting it out. It works and runs the g code if I short it out.

My setup has the spindle set to off. I will try your settings and let you know how I go.

Thank you again for your info...However I must say that "Andy" may be a knowledgeable guy but he has not been the best person to deal with. In my previous post I stated that my setup was apparently the 1st time he has done it this way. I am using Windows 7 with USB port with THC.

Mtw fdu.
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Re: New member and a problem-Camcutcnc

Post by Mtw fdu »

@tm America

I tried all your settings but still no luck. I appreciate your time and input but I am going to have to wait to see if "Andy" gives me what I need to get me cutting (if that ever happens). I have spent a lot of money and I am not happy.

I mean no ill feeling towards you as again I appreciate your time and input with helping me through this.

Mtw fdu. :x
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Re: New member and a problem-Camcutcnc

Post by tm america »

My first cnc plasma was from camcut.. i had pretty much the same story as you it was a year before i had a working machine.... I am wondering if the issue is with running win7 .. i had the same problem with the last one i built using mach.. i tried to use a win 7 computer and everything worked but the torch would not trigger.. I switched to a windows xp computer and it worked....mach is suppose to be able to work with win7 but if you read thru the artsoft forum you will see 99% of the time it doesn't,, And when it does you really have to build the computer just for that and need to install special drivers and have the correct video card..Please post more pics of your controller board and i will see what you might need to do to get it up and running..If you don't mind not using win7 and not having a usb i can give you a 130 dollar solution
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Re: New member and a problem-Camcutcnc

Post by tm america »

Please post a sample of your code and if you could do a screen shot of your ports and pins-input signals and output signals.also a screen shot of your spindle setup page.. from these i will be able to verify if everything is right with those and then help you with tracking it down if it is not in that area.....i am willing to help you thru getting your machine up and running.. I need more info on the computer you are using as well as the usb converter he used on your machine..Looks like it has a tb 6560 controller .. but there are a couple posibilities of what he might have used for the usb converter.. The more info the better i can do at taking you right to the problem or being able to see if i have the correct setting for you already..
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Re: New member and a problem-Camcutcnc

Post by Mtw fdu »

@tm America

It would be quicker if you can pm me your email as loading on here will take a lot of time. I have got all the pics you already on an sd card which for the same reason I tried to do it with Andy. But he refuses every time.

Thanks again.

Mtw fdu.
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