Hi def/Oxygen Plasma

[esracerx46]

I currently have a Thermal A-120. Have not really had a good experience with it. Had the machine replaced once already among a handful of other issues and its less than 18 months old. So with the bad experiences and the fact that we have found ourselves cutting thicker plate than first anticipated its almost time to upgrade anyways. Was wondering if anyone had any experience with any of these machines and what machine might be suggested. I don't know much about the differences between the two. We're starting to cut 1'' steel plate somewhat regularly and have found a use for a machine that could handle 2'', but that would be a rarity so I might be better off just getting an oxy-fuel attachment. I dont really think I can afford a brand new machine, but their is a plethora of used machines out there, I just don't really know what to look for, or whats what when looking at used machines as far as model and price. Would I be able to use a water table with either types. And what kind of inlet power is suggested? Thanks in advance!!

[trucutcnc]

For cutting 1"+ on a regular basis you should really step up to oxygen plasma. The only downside to that is that the table and the plasma will cost quite a bit more. I would not buy an old oxygen or high definition plasma. They can be had cheap, but there's a reason for that. Once you go over 120A, everything has high frequency arc start. When the transformers and wiring start getting old, there can be a massive amount of HF leakage, which means when you strike an arc, every computer in the building will shut down.

A 200A power supply, such as a TD AutoCut 200 runs about $20,000+-. The equivalent in Hypertherm would be the MaxPro200. I'm partial to the AutoCut because it can use a water mist as the secondary shield gas, which does a sweet job on stainless and aluminum. The MaxPro can only use air or N2. Using a water table with these machines is not a problem.

The two major players in plasma are TD and Hypertherm. Neither of them will hold up long term when you run them wide open all day long. The torches are not liquid cooled so many of the problems you'll encounter are torch related or related to excessive heat build-up.

The table is the other major expense. You're getting into industrial plasma where desktop PC's don't work well. Out Titan table set up with an AutoCut or UltraCut uses ProMotion controls. Koike and Victory make a nice table as well and offer a couple different options for controls.

Just out of curiosity, what problems are you having with the A120?

[natewelding]

i also have a thermal a-120, had the machine replaced once because it wouldnt run unless you had you hand next to the voltage knob... got a new one and havent had any real issues since, but mine cuts 1" like its butter, smooth clean cut everytime

[jimcolt]

Hypertherm's HPRxd oxygen based HyDefinition cutting systems have the option to use their patented True Hole Process for cutting round holes in steel with virtually no taper. These systems must use an approved CNC, THC as well as CAM software system.......they automatically interpret the small features and holes from a standard .dxf file (drawn with any CAD software) and add the proper lead in, hole speeds as well as switching the shield gas to pure oxygen (a Hypertherm patent).....which produces an aggressive cutting arc for eliminating taper in holes. The operator and programmer do nothing different.....the entire True Hole process is automated.

Jim Colt

True Hole 001.jpg

True Hole 004.jpg

with true hole.png

[jimcolt]

Actually....there are a few hundred thousand industrial cnc machines out there in the world using High Frequency start plasma systems. These industrial machines use cnc controls that are PC based, but are industrially hardened to deal with electrical RF noise that is produced in the starting circuit of the 100% duty cycle industrial plasma systems. Industrial quality machine do not use a standard PC or Laptop as the CNC.

Further, industrial cnc plasma machines are built with proper electrical cabling and grounding between the drive components (servo motors and servo drives, cnc control) as well as the plasma. All inputs and outputs are properly isolated and filtered......electrical noise interference is not an issue when using high frequency start plasma on machines that are designed for that type of plasma!

Hypertherm has a line of air plasma systems from 45 amps to 105 amps that use a non high frequency (blowback) staring system (patented by Hypertherm, copied by many others!)....this technology was developed to eliminate the problems on low cost and entry level cnc machines that used standard office computers and laptops as the cnc. The blowback mechanism workd very well on these lower cost, lower cutting tolerance systems......but cannot hold the consumable parts in an accurate enough concentricity to work as well on the high definition class industrial plasma systems....so all of the industrial plasma's above 120 amps are liquid cooled and use a high voltage or high frequency start mechanism.

All of Hypertherm's systems over 120 amps are designed to operate wide open on the thickest rated materials at 100% duty cycle. There are thousands of users that operate these systems 3 shifts a day, seven days a week. The Powermax air plasma systems (like all air plasmas) are air cooled and designed at lower duty cycles. I just wanted to point out that there is a whole different world of plasma's as used on industrial cnc's......as compared to the low cost air plasma systems often posted about o this site.

There is nothing in the Hyperthem high frequency start plasma system that changes over time that will increase any high frequency "leakage". An older Hypertherm system can operate as well after 10 or 20 years as it did when new. If you plan on buying a used high frequency start plasma system.....it should only be used on machines that are designed for use with that type of plasma. Putting a high frequency start plasma on machines controlled by a laptop or PC is likely going to result in electrical noise issues that will disrupt operation.

Jim Colt Hypertherm

For cutting 1"+ on a regular basis you should really step up to oxygen plasma. The only downside to that is that the table and the plasma will cost quite a bit more. I would not buy an old oxygen or high definition plasma. They can be had cheap, but there's a reason for that. Once you go over 120A, everything has high frequency arc start. When the transformers and wiring start getting old, there can be a massive amount of HF leakage, which means when you strike an arc, every computer in the building will shut down.

A 200A power supply, such as a TD AutoCut 200 runs about $20,000+-. The equivalent in Hypertherm would be the MaxPro200. I'm partial to the AutoCut because it can use a water mist as the secondary shield gas, which does a sweet job on stainless and aluminum. The MaxPro can only use air or N2. Using a water table with these machines is not a problem.

The two major players in plasma are TD and Hypertherm. Neither of them will hold up long term when you run them wide open all day long. The torches are not liquid cooled so many of the problems you'll encounter are torch related or related to excessive heat build-up.

The table is the other major expense. You're getting into industrial plasma where desktop PC's don't work well. Out Titan table set up with an AutoCut or UltraCut uses ProMotion controls. Koike and Victory make a nice table as well and offer a couple different options for controls.

Just out of curiosity, what problems are you having with the A120?