First Project

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David K
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First Project

Post by David K »

Bought a new to me 4x4 table and figured I'd jump right on in the deep end. Diameter is 47". This is 16ga with 1.5" strap around it. Plastic sign back and strip LEDs. Color choices and display patterns are pretty darn extensive.
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adbuch
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Re: First Project

Post by adbuch »

Welcome aboard! That's a fantastic job! What kind of table did you buy, and what cutter are you using? Thanks for sharing your project with us.
David
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Joe Jones
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Re: First Project

Post by Joe Jones »

That is awesome! The illumination should be changed a bit, to handle the cold spots of the lighting, but otherwise, it looks great!

What did you use as internal lighting? Strips of LED lighting? Did you use the modular LED blocks wired in parallel, or the "Candy DOTS" tape strips?

Sometimes in a shallow sign pan like that, it would help greatly to add a couple layers of diffusers, spaced just a bit apart to disburse the light more evenly across the face. This is why some signs seem unnecessarily deep in dimension. Even though the LED lights do not need much pan depth to be installed, the light must be diffused over the depth so that the hot and cold spots are minimized, or negated completely.

I do not want to be a "party pooper" here, but I also do not see a weep hole at the bottom. This tells me that the sign has no back plate. It looks like it has a circle of white acrylic in front, sealed to the back of the face, perhaps around the edges. A back plate of steel, aluminum, or even exterior plywood or PVC board that seals the interior cavity would keep dirt and insects (wasps and dirt dobbers, for example) from collecting and building nests inside of it. Wasp nests inside of an illuminated sign become fire hazards over time.

Also, I know that money is always an issue, but I hope that you quoted the job to include repainting the wooden face of the gable, or the labor to remove or otherwise cover the rectangular strip of dirty Silicon that detracts from the new sign.

Finally, how is the sign mounted? I see no exterior surface tabs. I hope that you used a solid method, rather than just "hanging it on a nail. The wind has a way of removing large round disks that are not securely fastened to an exterior wall like this. I would hate to see it pulled off of the mount by a strong wind. It would not survive a fall from that height, and if this is a commercial location where customers wander freely, I am certain your insurance company will have something to say about a large metal disk hanging over their heads. An open cavity round sign like this is a prime target for destruction by wind, and it presents a hazard for the unsuspecting public. I suggest the customer shows a photo of this sign to his insurance agent, to get their BLESSING on the sign.

Did you check local sign codes for exterior illuminated signage? Here in Kentucky, it would not be much of a problem. However, if this is hanging in a place like Commiefornia, where code violations are irresistible FINE CANDY, at some point a nosey bureaucrat is going to want to see a permit for the sign, and a UL Listing tag somewhere visible to the outside. All of this is because it is a sign MEANT to attract the public to the location. They call them "Bug Lights."

Walk under any commercial "Channel Letter" signage mounted to exterior walls and look up. Each letter will have at least one weep hole for water, and at least ONE of the letters will have the UL LISTING TAG placed to be visible from the ground. A sign on the side of a private barn that reads, "Grandpa's Hobby Shop" is one thing. However, in many States, a commercial sign, and that is what this is, must meet certain Municipal, County and/or State signage CODES in order to be hung like this.

This is why I do not dabble in lighted signs. In a post apocalyptic world, where all of the bureaucrats have been righteously shot, it would not matter. But a large, steel, lighted sign that is visible to the public is a magnet for the "Code Police."

Joe



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adbuch
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Re: First Project

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PM sent.
David K
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Re: First Project

Post by David K »

adbuch wrote: Tue Apr 05, 2022 1:24 am Welcome aboard! That's a fantastic job! What kind of table did you buy, and what cutter are you using? Thanks for sharing your project with us.
David
Table is a Torchmate 4x4. Cutter is a Lincoln Tomahawk 625. I run an old 1957 Wayne compressor for air. A trusty old beast.
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Joe Jones
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Re: First Project

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David K wrote: Tue Apr 05, 2022 9:51 pm I run an old 1957 Wayne compressor for air. A trusty old beast.
Is that one of those old "Thump! Thump!" compressors that runs so quietly, but still provides plenty of air? I love those things! There is one in Nashville, and old compressor from many decades ago. two pistons that run slowly, but the wheel that the motor drives gives them the horsepower they need to quietly provide air for the shop. The sound reminds me of a steam locomotive just leaving the train station.

Joe



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David K
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Re: First Project

Post by David K »

Joe Jones wrote: Tue Apr 05, 2022 2:03 am That is awesome! The illumination should be changed a bit, to handle the cold spots of the lighting, but otherwise, it looks great!

What did you use as internal lighting? Strips of LED lighting? Did you use the modular LED blocks wired in parallel, or the "Candy DOTS" tape strips?

Sometimes in a shallow sign pan like that, it would help greatly to add a couple layers of diffusers, spaced just a bit apart to disburse the light more evenly across the face. This is why some signs seem unnecessarily deep in dimension. Even though the LED lights do not need much pan depth to be installed, the light must be diffused over the depth so that the hot and cold spots are minimized, or negated completely.
I completely agree. The lighting could be improved. This is just a strip led light setup that was abandon by my daughter from her bedroom and repurposed into this light. Sticky back onto the 1.5" strap and then covered in clear caulking. Pre-caulking photo below.
Joe Jones wrote: Tue Apr 05, 2022 2:03 am I do not want to be a "party pooper" here, but I also do not see a weep hole at the bottom. This tells me that the sign has no back plate. It looks like it has a circle of white acrylic in front, sealed to the back of the face, perhaps around the edges. A back plate of steel, aluminum, or even exterior plywood or PVC board that seals the interior cavity would keep dirt and insects (wasps and dirt dobbers, for example) from collecting and building nests inside of it. Wasp nests inside of an illuminated sign become fire hazards over time.
Weep hole is on the agenda when the sign comes down to paint the barn. I do not feel a backing plate is warranted in my area for critters but time will tell. I am in this barn/shop every day.
Joe Jones wrote: Tue Apr 05, 2022 2:03 am Also, I know that money is always an issue, but I hope that you quoted the job to include repainting the wooden face of the gable, or the labor to remove or otherwise cover the rectangular strip of dirty Silicon that detracts from the new sign.
New sign definitely highlights the need for new paint. This will be addressed within the next few weeks.
Joe Jones wrote: Tue Apr 05, 2022 2:03 am Finally, how is the sign mounted? I see no exterior surface tabs. I hope that you used a solid method, rather than just "hanging it on a nail. The wind has a way of removing large round disks that are not securely fastened to an exterior wall like this. I would hate to see it pulled off of the mount by a strong wind. It would not survive a fall from that height, and if this is a commercial location where customers wander freely, I am certain your insurance company will have something to say about a large metal disk hanging over their heads. An open cavity round sign like this is a prime target for destruction by wind, and it presents a hazard for the unsuspecting public. I suggest the customer shows a photo of this sign to his insurance agent, to get their BLESSING on the sign.
See pic below. I welded a strap across the back and that fits into a 2x4 with a 45 degree cut along its length. A modified French cleat if you will. No only does this have positive engagement into the cleat itself but also forces the sign into the wall. Alos, if you look at the pic below you will see that there are four bolt on the back that are adjustable. THis allows me to allow add tension from the sign back to the cleat. When I take the sign down to paint the wall I will snap a pic. No customer on this one. It's mine which is even worse. I've always been my own worst critic!
Joe Jones wrote: Tue Apr 05, 2022 2:03 am Did you check local sign codes for exterior illuminated signage? Here in Kentucky, it would not be much of a problem. However, if this is hanging in a place like Commiefornia, where code violations are irresistible FINE CANDY, at some point a nosey bureaucrat is going to want to see a permit for the sign, and a UL Listing tag somewhere visible to the outside. All of this is because it is a sign MEANT to attract the public to the location. They call them "Bug Lights."

Walk under any commercial "Channel Letter" signage mounted to exterior walls and look up. Each letter will have at least one weep hole for water, and at least ONE of the letters will have the UL LISTING TAG placed to be visible from the ground. A sign on the side of a private barn that reads, "Grandpa's Hobby Shop" is one thing. However, in many States, a commercial sign, and that is what this is, must meet certain Municipal, County and/or State signage CODES in order to be hung like this.

This is why I do not dabble in lighted signs. In a post apocalyptic world, where all of the bureaucrats have been righteously shot, it would not matter. But a large, steel, lighted sign that is visible to the public is a magnet for the "Code Police."

This sign IS in Commiefornia! However it is on my property and I am out in the country. It would have to be dealt with at the County Level with thankfully is a bit slower here. If someone has an issue with it they will have to get in line behind the other people that I have pissed off over the years! :)

I appreciate the feedback, Joe!
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David K
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Re: First Project

Post by David K »

Joe Jones wrote: Tue Apr 05, 2022 10:14 pm
David K wrote: Tue Apr 05, 2022 9:51 pm I run an old 1957 Wayne compressor for air. A trusty old beast.
Is that one of those old "Thump! Thump!" compressors that runs so quietly, but still provides plenty of air? I love those things! There is one in Nashville, and old compressor from many decades ago. two pistons that run slowly, but the wheel that the motor drives gives them the horsepower they need to quietly provide air for the shop. The sound reminds me of a steam locomotive just leaving the train station.

Joe



.
This is the ol' boy here. Fairly quiet. Highly dependable and made in the USA!
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Joe Jones
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Re: First Project

Post by Joe Jones »

That is a solid mount. The wind would not only have to pull the sign away from the all. It would also have to lift it off of the mount. Good job on that!

Critters? Well, I was thinking more of wasps and whatever. Bees? A bee hive could develop behind that sign without your knowledge.

Here in the Commonwealth of Kentucky (Pull a tooth out when you say that, Mister!) we have these things that are rather scary looking, but basically harmless. They are called "Dirt Dobbers." They look like wasps, and they CAN stink you and ruin your day, but they are not aggressive. A simple gentle wave of a hand will deflect their flight path away from you. They build these ever expanding nests out of balls of mud. They like to $%^&* up circuit boards, and light sockets, and basically anything that can generate heat or light. The nests become rock hard and difficult to remove. Even pressure washers struggle to remove them.

We also have these $#%^& fat black hornets! They are super aggressive. They attack light, sound, movement, and whatever pisses them off, and you have to run to put some distance between you and the nest before they cease their attack. They are lightning fast when they attack from a distance. I am allergic to their stings, but I've only been stung once in 11 years. WOW! That hurt! It stung me under my left eye, and my face immediately swelled up like a melon. I rushed to the Doc-In-The Box for an injection of something to get on top of the venom. He wants me to carry an Epi-Pen with me, but I have learned how to look for them and NOT anger them.

We also have something called a "Cow Killer." It is a wingless wasp that is beautiful to look at. Like a giant ant, with alternating jet black and bright red stripes. It is not aggressive, but it is said to have one of the most painful insect sting of all. It attacks the nervous system, and it is said that "the pain could kill a cow!" I've seen three or four of them here on my property. As long as you leave them alone, they will leave you alone, but don't sit on one, or step on one, or trap one under your arm, etc. That would not be good. Also, don't KILL one. The other wasps are WATCHING YOU! They don't like it when someone kills a cow killer. Not one little bit.



Beyond that, my home is in the "country." So I have all of the usual critters, several kinds of snakes, but only three of them are poisonous, the rattle snakes, the cottonmouth snakes and the copperheads. A few years ago, a gopher snake found its way into my home. It apparently chased a mouse through a hole in the wall. :HaHa Man, that snake was FAST! My home looked like it had a visit from the Tasmanian Devil after I caught that snake.

Joe



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Franklin, KY., USA
Samson 510 & 4x4
6” Z Rail Lift Kit for PlasmaCam
CreatBot D600 PRO 3D Printer
12 Lasers
FREE DesignEdge Training!

It is more fun when it isn't necessary!
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Re: First Project

Post by bigcreek »

You did a great job on that sign. I am very impressed that I cannot see any warpage at all in that 16 gauge sheet with all that cutting from the leaves.
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