Hypertherm vs Kjellberg plasma (inverter type)

[gzm.pepe]

Hello everyone.

Everyone knows Hypertherm's plasma sources, they are very good, no one doubts it, but I'm curious to know if anyone has experience with the German plasma sources of the Kjellberg Finsterwalde brand, especially in cnc plasma tables. In the inverter type plasma sources I have seen that the Hypertherm Powermax105 model and the Kjellberg CutFire 100i are very similar in characteristics and price.

It seems that the Kjellberg plasma source is superior because it can mark the metal and has a 100% duty cycle and the Hyperthrem does not mark and has ponly 80% duty cycle.

Which one do you think is better and why?

[acourtjester]

I think your location should be a facture, if repairs are needed where are the repairs done.
Looking at their web page it shows China as a base of operations, with world wide distributors but no listings of where.

[robertspark]

Which one do you think is better and why?

hypertherm.... you get a comprehensive owners manual and a comprehensive service manual...
https://www.hypertherm.com/Download?fil ... &zip=False
https://www.weldersupply.com/Content/fi ... Manual.pdf

hypertherm 105, cutting power 105A at 160V, cutting power (output) rating therefore 16,800W ..... power factor is 0.94

the duty cycle is clearly given and clearly varies as the output current changes.

All honest, open and clear.....

2019-12-17 14_31_32-Powermax105 Service Manual (807580 revision 3).png

Kjellberg CutFire 100

has a manual available (better than a lot i have seen).... but via google search (on a russian website....why not the german manufacturer??)
http://kb-firdavil.ru/upload/pdf/kjllbe ... 12-019.pdf

Kjellberg CutFire 100, cutting power is 100A at 130V, cutting power (output) rating is therefore 13,000W (the hypertherm has 30% more power output density.... it will give a cleaner cut!)

The Kjellberg CutFire 100 is also High Frequency Pilot Arc...... the hypertherm is blowback start..... less electromagnetic noise and potential issues with CNC.

2019-12-17 14_39_10-neu2012-07-03-o-SD-CutFire100i-en-BA2012-019.pdf.png

I guess it depends what you want to cut and how bothered you are by the cut quality at the end....

[jimcolt]

Great comparison by robertspark. The Kjellberg's duty cycle is rated at a lower wattage output (100 A x 130 Volts or 13kW) vs the Powermax105's duty cycle rated at 105 Amps @ 160 volts or 16,800 watts. So if you calculate the duty cycle when cutting at the same load voltage and amperage you will find the Powermax dudty cycle is higher. Expect thicker capacity and faster speeds on thick materials with the Hypertherm. Many manufacturers publish duty cycle numbers that are true, however are rated at lower load voltage (lower load voltage is only achieved when cutting thinner materials), this makes the system look better on the brochure! Hypertherm systems always show the duty cycle rating on the thickest production (pierce) rating that the system is capable of.....when you cut thinner materials the duty cycle increases.

Hypertherm outsells the Kjellberg worldwide and offers the industries best worldwide support for parts and service. Jim Colt

[gzm.pepe]

Which one do you think is better and why?

hypertherm.... you get a comprehensive owners manual and a comprehensive service manual...
https://www.hypertherm.com/Download?fil ... &zip=False
https://www.weldersupply.com/Content/fi ... Manual.pdf

hypertherm 105, cutting power 105A at 160V, cutting power (output) rating therefore 16,800W ..... power factor is 0.94

the duty cycle is clearly given and clearly varies as the output current changes.

All honest, open and clear.....

2019-12-17 14_31_32-Powermax105 Service Manual (807580 revision 3).png

Kjellberg CutFire 100

has a manual available (better than a lot i have seen).... but via google search (on a russian website....why not the german manufacturer??)
http://kb-firdavil.ru/upload/pdf/kjllbe ... 12-019.pdf

Kjellberg CutFire 100, cutting power is 100A at 130V, cutting power (output) rating is therefore 13,000W (the hypertherm has 30% more power output density.... it will give a cleaner cut!)

The Kjellberg CutFire 100 is also High Frequency Pilot Arc...... the hypertherm is blowback start..... less electromagnetic noise and potential issues with CNC.

2019-12-17 14_39_10-neu2012-07-03-o-SD-CutFire100i-en-BA2012-019.pdf.png

I guess it depends what you want to cut and how bothered you are by the cut quality at the end....

Wow, awesome answer robertspark, thanks, it is very helpful for me

[gzm.pepe]

Great comparison by robertspark. The Kjellberg's duty cycle is rated at a lower wattage output (100 A x 130 Volts or 13kW) vs the Powermax105's duty cycle rated at 105 Amps @ 160 volts or 16,800 watts. So if you calculate the duty cycle when cutting at the same load voltage and amperage you will find the Powermax dudty cycle is higher. Expect thicker capacity and faster speeds on thick materials with the Hypertherm. Many manufacturers publish duty cycle numbers that are true, however are rated at lower load voltage (lower load voltage is only achieved when cutting thinner materials), this makes the system look better on the brochure! Hypertherm systems always show the duty cycle rating on the thickest production (pierce) rating that the system is capable of.....when you cut thinner materials the duty cycle increases.

Hypertherm outsells the Kjellberg worldwide and offers the industries best worldwide support for parts and service. Jim Colt

Thanks Jim, it is more clear to me now

[Andre]

Consider these points:

• the mentioned high frequency pilot arc (depending on your table)
• the availability in the states
• you have to convert material thickness, cut speed, ...

The technical data sheet above is older than two years.
Here are the latest informations directly from the Kjellberg Homepage



If you want to calculate the power output again. 40 mm (1.57 Inch) at 100 A is over 180 V.
For any further questions, feel free to post them.

[robertspark]

If you want to calculate the power output again. 40 mm (1.57 Inch) at 100 A is over 180 V.

Cutfire 100i
Datasheet Connected load 16.6kVA

100A @ 180V >> Power = Volts x Amps >> 100 x 180 = 18kW

how can the cutting power EVER be greater than the kVA rating (which we presume will have some power factor ~0.94 maybe??)

[Andre]

At this point, I don't know who made the data sheet, but I can see the cutting charts and I know that it is cutting the 40mm at 100% duty cycle.
Maybe the data sheet needs a revision. I can check this in the next couple days.