Help with Proma 150 and Mach3

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tas99
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Help with Proma 150 and Mach3

Post by tas99 »

I have a Proma 150 and Mach 3 and when in Proma test mode I can see the Torch On, TorchUp and Torch Down signals operating correctly on the Diagnostic Screen but the Z of the torch never moves.

Is it supposed to move up and down in Test Mode?

I think I've enabled THC in Mach3 properly but does anyone know all that should be done to get it to run?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Tom
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Re: Help with Proma 150 and Mach3

Post by acourtjester »

It has been a long time since I used a Proma, try making the HYS voltage higher that may give you a longer time for the proma to move. And that would give you a longer time for each function. Again not sure.
I have this image from back then try that check box on I know I have seen the Z move up/down, but cannot remember what setting made is happen.
THC options.jpg
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Re: Help with Proma 150 and Mach3

Post by tas99 »

I have that box checked along with THC on the Program Run screen as well as Allow THC UP/DOWN Control even if not in THC Mode.
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Re: Help with Proma 150 and Mach3

Post by acourtjester »

her is another thing do you have this box on click on the button to turn it on/off
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Re: Help with Proma 150 and Mach3

Post by tas99 »

Yup, I have that box checked as well.
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Re: Help with Proma 150 and Mach3

Post by acourtjester »

Here is a write up I did when I first installed the Proma (2013) don't use them anymore.
THC install info.pdf
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Re: Help with Proma 150 and Mach3

Post by tas99 »

Thanks for the video.

I tried it with and without that box checked, no difference.

The THC up and down signals are being seen by Mach3 because I can see the THC lights (up/down) alternate on the diagnostic page in sync with the up/down signals from the THC I just don't see any corresponding up/down movement on the Z/torch head.
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Re: Help with Proma 150 and Mach3

Post by acourtjester »

Have you actually performed a cut with the THC, since you have seen the indication in Mach it may work fine. Set the HYS voltage to 1 volt so you will see movement of the torch with small changes for testing. Cut about a 6 inch line and you should see if things are working, just watch the Z DRO for movement.
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Re: Help with Proma 150 and Mach3

Post by tas99 »

I haven't actually run the plasma cutter yet. I'm in the process of finishing the water pan which is the last item and I'll give it a test run then and let you know what happens.
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Re: Help with Proma 150 and Mach3

Post by PlasmaWorx.com »

Okay sorry to High-jack but i'm having the same issue with a Proma SD 150 MD i have it connected to a TD52 [Thermal Dynamics CutMaster 52] and a Premier Plasma 4x8 table. When i bought the table I opt for the THC at the same time. I too just finished my water table and its not 100% flat i figured what better time to setup/install the THC. [2 years later] the THC was wired into the BOB by the company the only connections I had to make was between the plasma cutter and the THC i went with arc voltage because I didn't want to spend $300 on a automation board for DIV voltage. I connected the THC Arc voltage to the outer most ports on the Proma, I get a voltage reading but after the first cut it only wants to start the arc it doesn't move from the pierce location. When putting the Proma in test mode i see the display showing Voltage up and down but no Z axis movement is happening. I did go to [Config/Port.Pins/Input Signals] and made sure the THC On/Up/Down are activated. I also made sure that the THC toggle is on on the main program/run screen. I pulled out my DVM to check the output wires from the Proma middle 2 wires for up and down But nothing is changing it shows .721v and doesnt move at the same time the Proma display is showing that it is changing the voltage, but the funny thing is on the Proma display it does not show up and down LED changes.

Any help would be great currently trying to build a donated sign to a dance studio for their Zoom Classes and branding for their YouTube tutorial videos

Thanks again, Johnny
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Re: Help with Proma 150 and Mach3

Post by robertspark »

PlasmaWorx.com wrote: Mon Jun 01, 2020 2:37 pm ... Proma SD 150 MD .....
Is it a proma SD

https://www.proma-elektronika.com/compa ... generator/

Or

Is it a proma 150.....
https://www.proma-elektronika.com/compact-thc-150/

They are very different in output wiring

The SD wires directly to the z axis stepper motor (actually it is installed between the motion controller and the z axis)


The 150 wires back to the motion controller and provides arc ok, up and down signals
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Re: Help with Proma 150 and Mach3

Post by PlasmaWorx.com »

Mine has 150 SD MD on it it looks like someone covered 150 and MD with black sharpie... so my guess is low budget Model Identification method. meaning they mark out the ones its not to save on cost of actually printing a sticker with the proper model. I would have to say then my system is a SD?

The way that the manufacture [Premire Plasma] wired the controller Pic down below
Brown [- (power supply from Micro Driver)]
Blue [+ (power supply from Micro Driver)]
White [PUL +(+5v)]
Black [goes to BOB (Up)]
Red [DIR + (+5v) on Micro Driver]
Green [goes to BOB (Down)]


Model Identification
Image
Wiring
Image
CNC Board
Image
Micro Driver
Image
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Re: Help with Proma 150 and Mach3

Post by robertspark »

The black and green are not up and down

They are the z axis step (black - lpt pin 6), and direction (green - lpt port pin 7)

You don't define thc up and thc down with that thc.

Thc up and down are INPUTS.

Z axis step and direction are outputs and correlate with lpt port pins 6 and 7 as they are outputs.

Basically you need to turn off thc in mach3 as the proma SD is a stand alone THC ...... You have no way to control it from within mach3 ..... It measures the voltage and moves the z axis up and down according to the setpoint.

It provides no feedback to mach3 (at all)

You have two options..... (Three actually)

1) turn off thc in mach3.... It is waiting for an arcok signal which is not arriving so when the machine pierces it waits for arc ok..... And waits and waits and waits.....

2) if your plasma cutter has an arc ok signal (a CNC connector on it) then you can wire this arc ok signal back to your breakout board.... You will need a free input.... This will allow you to enable thc in mach3 which will wait for arc ok before beginning motion or the pierce delay countdown.

3) sell the proma and buy a better thc ! :HaHa .... They are not very good at all....
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Re: Help with Proma 150 and Mach3

Post by PlasmaWorx.com »

LOL Thanks for the help robertspark. I found some wiring diagrams online that show a little more of a diagram. So my next question is when in test mode shouldn't I be getting THC movement up and down? if so does the green LED lights on the controller show this on the SD model?

I don't want to buy the automation board because it looks like a after thought i would rather spend money on a hyperthem machine that is only for automation. [Any input on which would be best for cutting up to 1/2" ?]

What is a good THC? this one came with the machine for an extra $110.00 at the time I was like why not. Premier Plasma has terrible responses when it comes to support. I didn't expect much and I will say I have made my money back on the machine but I think I would have been better off with a CNC Router Parts Plasma Table.

Thanks Again for the help.
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Re: Help with Proma 150 and Mach3

Post by robertspark »

PlasmaWorx.com wrote: Mon Jun 01, 2020 7:27 pm What is a good THC?
For a low cost / effective THC, although I've never used one, the Price AVHC seems to be recommended by a few on here
https://www.pricecnc.com/product-page/avhc10

I have a miniTHC ..... it allows you to change the voltage setting from within gcode (or on screen if you set up the buttons on the screen)
https://minithc.com/

Which is in the similar price band.
PlasmaWorx.com wrote: Mon Jun 01, 2020 7:27 pm ....thought i would rather spend money on a hyperthem machine that is only for automation. [Any input on which would be best for cutting up to 1/2" ?]
Hypertherm Powermax 45XP which if ordered with a machine torch will come with a CPC (machine) connector {CHECK!!!}

The machine connector provides divided arc voltage (changeable via internal dip switches) and also the ARC OK signal and also allows you to turn the torch on and off via a relay.

The Operator and Service Manuals are very helpful

https://www.hypertherm.com/Download?fil ... &zip=False
https://www.hypertherm.com/Download?fil ... &zip=False
https://www.rapidwelding.com/files/Hype ... Manual.pdf

PlasmaWorx.com wrote: Mon Jun 01, 2020 7:27 pm I found some wiring diagrams online that show a little more of a diagram. So my next question is when in test mode shouldn't I be getting THC movement up and down? if so does the green LED lights on the controller show this on the SD model?
The proma SD manual is here:
https://www.proma-elektronika.com/downl ... csd_en.pdf

I've never owned an "SD" (I did own a "150"... but sold it on)
The last page says
"tSt" (Test) - Simulation of the controller's work - the system simulates the appearance of "floating" voltage within the selected value - causes the activation of inputs for easy system testing without switching the cutter on.
I would presume that it should jolt the Z axis up and down to prove that it works / is connected correctly.

Question:
Are you using Mach3?
If so, are you using a motion controller, of does that LPT break out board connect directly to the printer port of the rear of the PC?
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Re: Help with Proma 150 and Mach3

Post by acourtjester »

I second Roberts suggestion of the Price THC, easy hookup, comes with its own Post Processor. Very nice unit and has 30 memory position for different cutting operations built in. I would go with the Hypertherm 65 as there is more power if needed, machine torch too. If you lose the printer port you can replace the BOB with a USB type, just reload Mach 3 without the printer driver. This one will work on Win 10 also and has 5 inputs needed for limits. probe, and THC inputs.
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Re: Help with Proma 150 and Mach3

Post by robertspark »

Oh, check your power supply availability as the powermax 65 obviously requires more current than a 45xp....

(+ outside of north america (European Market ("CE"), the 65 is NOT available as single phase [because of the internal filter])
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Re: Help with Proma 150 and Mach3

Post by PlasmaWorx.com »

Question:
Are you using Mach3?
If so, are you using a motion controller, of does that LPT break out board connect directly to the printer port of the rear of the PC?
Yes i am using Mach3

I'll look into the HyperTherm. As far as I can tell the Proma is suppose to jog it up and down but does not. I did try disabling everything inside the Mach program since its suppose to be a stand alone unit and it didn't make any difference.
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Re: Help with Proma 150 and Mach3

Post by acourtjester »

There has been many posts with people having problems with the SD
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Re: Help with Proma 150 and Mach3

Post by robertspark »

PlasmaWorx.com wrote: Tue Jun 02, 2020 11:59 am As far as I can tell the Proma is suppose to jog it up and down but does not. I did try disabling everything inside the Mach program since its suppose to be a stand alone unit and it didn't make any difference.
check that this box is unticked too
2020-06-02 20_29_33-Mach3 CNC  Demo.png
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Re: Help with Proma 150 and Mach3

Post by PlasmaWorx.com »

I did untick the check box the test mode on the proma still doesn't move the torch up and down while the voltage displays higher and lower then the selected arch voltage.

I ended up shooting for the moon this morning and chancing it to cut my sign it did okay for the most part but as the aluminum heated and and things warped the torch head started to plunge into the aluminum plate and drove the floating head 5 inches below the "set" 0 point. I stopped it and went back to line 1400 and ran it from the plunged area again and it went fine but i had to disable the THC all together to finish the 40"x90" sign

Image
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Re: Help with Proma 150 and Mach3

Post by robertspark »

Can you post your Mach3 profile please

It will be the *.XML file with the name that matches the one on the Mach3 screen

You will need to open it in Notepad or Notepad++, and copy and past it here.

Please include it within the code ( button marked : "</>" above when you reply) section and I can take a look, thanks (it makes life much easier than just guessing + I get confused with how many people are asking different questions over a period of time {sorry}..... age.... a lot of recaps required....
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Re: Help with Proma 150 and Mach3

Post by Dominykasssx »

Hello. I have similar problem running Proma 150 not SD version with Mach3. Connected arc_ok, up and down. I can see those inputs in diagnostics tab, they working fine. But I can't get Z axis moving.
Tried checked and unchecked Config>Ports and pins>Mill options> Allow THC UP/DOWN Controll even if not in THC mode
THC button is green in "Program run" menu tab. Now THC speed is set to 20%, THC max 10, THC min -10. Z axis is not moving not a little. Is it possible to make it work with Mach3 red cheap board like this: https://www.vallder.com/images/stories/ ... roller.jpg

I tried to find information about settings you need to make, but I only find out that you need some kind of parallel board to make it work, because Mach3 is to slow to handle THC and move Z axis. I just brought Proma 150 and I can't make it work. Please help me if it's possible.
Z axis only work with Gcode or with hotkeys.
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Re: Help with Proma 150 and Mach3

Post by DIYPlasmatable »

Hey, has anyone ever figured out Proma SD no Z axis movement?!
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